Cheryl Schatz

Jessica,
Welcome to my blog! I always appreciate when complementarians are willing to dialog.

For me, it isn’t so much that Eve usurped Adam’s authority, but she denied the goodness of God. The serpent taunted her with the fruit and insinuated that God was holding out on her in some way. Eve’s sin was that she believed Satan’s word rather than believing God’s and then she acted on it.

I would like to point out something that you said. You said “For me, it (is)…(Eve) denied the goodness of God.” Actually the sin was eating the fruit. The cause of the sin was believing the lie about God which was the deception. The Bible doesn’t say that Eve denied the goodness of God. There is a subtle difference. The serpent is the one who lied about God but Eve did not tell the serpent that God is not good. Nor did she tell this to Adam or to God. She just believed the lie.

I am a firm believer that Adam shares full responsibility for “the curse.”

Adam does share full responsibility for the curses, but his sharing is with the serpent not with Eve. God makes it clear in His word that it was one man who brought sin into the world. Eve does not share in any way with the curse brought on the earth. That is what God’s word says and even if we are tempted to rationalize a blame for Eve, God’s word doesn’t let us.

The Scriptures are very clear that he was right there with Eve. At any point he could have stood up and said, “No Eve, this isn’t what’s best for us.

I completely agree with you here. Adam indeed was there with Eve and it not only could have spoken up, he was obligated to do so as the one who was not deceived by the lie.

Together they sinned and denied that God is good and trustworthy. For me, I think that is the greatest sin and issue out of this passage.

Jessica, I think you have missed something. Remember that Adam was not deceived. He was not deceived into believing that God is not good or not trustworthy. The greatest sin is for Adam to have eaten the fruit when he knew everything that had been said was a lie. He ate in full rebellion knowing that God is good and knowing that only God is the creator and we cannot be any more like Him than what we were created as in His image. He knew that there was no godship waiting for him. He sinned in full rebellion and this is the greatest sin that God calls treachery in Hosea 6:7.

Even though the Bible doesn’t explicitly say this, it’s almost as if Adam was having doubts of God’s goodness and also desired to eat from the tree. I mean, if he had no desire would he have done it in the first place?

We can’t let ourselves be deceived about Adam. Adam did not have any doubts of God’s goodness because we know for sure that Adam was not deceived. Paul is a witness to this in 1 Timothy 2.

I don’t know, as a complementarian, how this passage shows that Eve usurped Adam’s authority. Because she gave him the fruit? And I’ve never heard the argument (from the comp side) that Eve should not have talked to the serpent…which, I agree, would lead to the practical application of a woman having to defer to her husband on (practically) any conversation. I don’t think that’s correct.

Wonderful! I am glad that the post got you thinking through this one complementarian error.

If only men can speak for/defend God then a woman would not be able to give her testimony, evangelize, or engage in apologetics–all of which I believe are biblical and commanded for both men and women.

More kudos for you! There are so many complementarian teachers out there who have so silenced women that God’s female “sons” are held back from fulfilling the calling of the gospel. I find this so incredibly sad.

While this post is under the heading of objections to women in ministry, I’d be interested in hearing your thoughts on headship (which was alluded to here). As well as, what do you think a woman can do in ministry and why (biblically)?

As far as headship goes, type in head or headship in the search on my blog and a bunch of posts should come up on this subject.

As far as what women can do in ministry, I believe very strongly that whatever God has gifted women to do they have the permission and authority to do. 1 Peter 4:10, 11 is the Biblical mandate for the ability for women to use their gifts in the power and strength that God gives them. The gifts that God gives are for the common good and not to be withheld from part of the body of Christ. This is from 1 Cor. 12:7. These two passages are what I rely on for the freedom for women to ministry in any way that God gifts and empowers them for God’s Holy Spirit is not to be held back just because He chooses to use a female vessel.

To be honest, even though we may not agree on certain issues of gender roles I appreciate honest and respectful discussion that helps me to understand more thoroughly what I believe, why, and its Scriptural base. But even as we disagree, the most important thing is “Jesus Christ and him crucified” (1 Cor. 2:2).

Amen! What a wonderful attitude that you have! I welcome any complementarian to my blog to dialog and the questions that I have been asked by comps has sparked a lot of good discussion and has been especially helpful for me to understand how I need to frame my answers with those who do not think along the same lines as I do. Col. 4:6 is a favorite verse of mine and I think that there is much that we can all learn as we practice love for one another even if we disagree on these secondary issues of faith. Although this verse is in the context of “outsiders”, I believe that it is a pattern of how we should talk with one another over all issues of disagreement so that we do not force another person into our own beliefs but gently dialog with respect.

Colossians 4:6 (NASB) Let your speech always be with grace, as though seasoned with salt, so that you will know how you should respond to each person.