Cheryl

Don,
You said: “In Hebrew thought, a neither/nor contruction can refer to one thing. For example, when Jesus in Mat 6:20 where thieves neither break in nor steal”

I still don’t see this as one thing. There is a crime of breaking and entering. That is trespassing. You can do that without stealing. Or you can break in and steal which is two things.

You said: “This is another reason why the meaning of authentein is pivotal. We cannot be sure if it is one or two things.” I think we can be sure that it is two things unless the bible uses a similar wording that is clearly one thing. By law, breaking in is one crime and stealing is another. You can be guilty of only theft or only breaking in but you can also be guilty of both. I still don’t see it as one thing, but I may be dense. Perhaps I am a tough nut to crack or a “confounded skeptic” as I have been called.

You said: “If it is 2 things then didasko/teach has no direct object and is therefore unrestricted in scope, which we KNOW is not true in general as Paul in other places says for women to teach other women; so we KNOW there MUST be a scope limitation somewhere in the sentence, else there is a contradiction.”

I believe that there is a definite scope. I think that it is along the lines of “I do not allow my girls to kiss or hug boys.” Who are the girls not allowed to kiss? The word boys would be understood to go along with both “kiss” and “hug”. I think the same construction is found in “I do not allow a woman to teach or to authenteo a man”. Here “a man” would be one whom she is not allowed to teach or authenteo. It would also make sense that if she is deceived, that she should not teach women or children either. However from the sentence construction, I am convinced that she is only teaching one man privately and not everyone publicly. I am also convinced that the touchy issue of interfering in a marriage is why Paul make a special issue of commanding Timothy to get involved and to make sure that the woman learns and stops teaching. Most people would hesitate to instruct someone else’s wife when the husband is doing nothing to stop her. I believe that this is why Timothy needed a push by Paul.

You said: “But besides that, it is possible that it is one thing that is being discussed, not two, as in I do not permit a woman to teach nor do X; but we need to know what X is.”
I think it is very helpful for us to know what X is. But even without knowing what X is, I think that we can establish that it isn’t a good thing and it is not for all women.

It is just such a sad thing that people have used this passage to forbid women to speak in church, be a bible teacher in their home where men attend, give directions to a lost man on the street and on and on… So many men haven’t tried hard enough to think through this difficult passage so that their sisters in Christ are not stumbled or restricted. Yet for those men who have worked hard to think through the passage, I am so grateful for those who support women and risk being treated badly for doing so.