Mark

Wow, we are up to comment 55 and still haven’t begun looking at the text!
You are correct in assuming that i haven’t read or know alot of what Wayne Grudem has written. In fact i have a book on the way which will help me understand his position. Piper on the other hand i have read much of, heard much of, and find an extroardinary man who seems humble and who’s first priority is glorifying God. You can criticise someones exegesis but i dont think it appropriate to criticise the man, or suggest his motives are bad.

That said i respect Suzanne for her work. I dont see her as a radical feminist but as an evangelical sister in Christ. The link i was given did in fact have very little research of hers. Im not disputing her research, just the link that i was given.

Chuch history is indeed full of ‘bad’ or mislead truth. BUt my point is simple, it is equally misleading to quote Cyril as ‘proof’ of the early church holding to kephale as source. It is simply not true, and history should be reflected accurately. If anyone knows of another church father who understood kephale this way, i would be more than happy to look into that.

I am still hesitant to read into the passage Kay quoted-‘authority’- it is simply poor exegesis to do this in my opinion. The passage has nothing to do with the sadducees wanting authority, they are simply trying to trick Jesus to refute the idea of a resurrection.

Kay, your summary of me made me laugh, but again has pulled me out of context. I dont have a right to demand my authority from my wife, that was point one. I’m not arguing for comp view to keep my authority point 2. Male authority is not linked to his manhood point 3.

Dave, i do think that their is a connection witht the misuse of biblical authority and abuse. I was simply trying to steer the conversation from such accusations as it is not reflective of true comp teaching. IF we are going to be far to both positions is should be based around their understanding of the scriptures. As far as im aware, i have never heard a comp encourage his congregation to beat up his wife. Thus why i am not interested in taking the slippery slope arguments any further.

Finally again i wil assert my three uses of kephale. Lin has said that i am claiming it means authority. This i haven’t said yet nor it is what i beleve it is always implying. These 3 meanings of the word are as far as i know, the accepted use of it.
1. That it does denote auhtority- partly seen in the LXX and other greek literature
2. That it is used as source in other greek literature
3. That it literally means the head on our shouders.
I have not stated which of these i think it means in 1 Cor 11 yet! I was just posting the known uses so we can all be on the same page before we begin.