Cheryl Schatz

Mark,
You said:

We needed God to do something to make us not-dead.

We are buried with Christ and resurrected with Him. How many times are we dead?

Ok I think I am getting closer to understanding your view…maybe! So God ‘draws’ everybody (however that works) and this is how God helps?

God does draw everyone and we cannot come to Him without this “work”.

But when the decision needs to be made then it is solely up to the person…correct? God does not help that person actually believe, he just draws them in however you understand that.

Of course He helps them to believe by giving them the unadulterated truth.

No I don’t know anyone who wants to separate Calvinists from non-calvinists. I don’t think that is anyone’s intention in our churches.

I have met more than enough Calvinists who want to charge me with heresy (semi-pelagianism) and who want to push Calvinism as if one cannot be a mature believer without it. And wasn’t it you too who called me a semi-pelagian? Calling someone a heretic is how people separate believers.

I simply want to know the truth. I want to know that if the act of saving faith is not something God gives to us, how can we say that we are therefore not adding something of our own to salvation?

Salvation is a miracle work and we cannot work this miracle. It is God’s work alone.

I can’t see how God draws every single person to himself when clearly not everyone knows about Christianity.

It is because drawing is not the same thing as coming.

I can’t see how as sinful people with a dead corrupt nature we can be expect people to accept Christ unless he opens their eyes to the message.

Of course God opens their eyes to the message, but opening one’s eyes is not a resurrection. The only resurrection that we experience is where we are buried with Christ and we are raised with Him. Can you please show me more than one spiritual resurrection?

“This is illogical. You are defining faith as having nothing at all to do with us.”

No, not at all, but I think we are at least getting to the heart of the matter- how free-choice and God’s sovereignty work together. Faith is our action, it has to be since people who don’t believe are condemned.

How can faith be our action if it is a “gift” given by God?

We believe because it is very much our decision to believe, yet we believe because it is very much God’s action to make us believe.

Believe is the action word. It is what we do. Where does the Bible say that God makes us believe?

This is where people stumble because they can’t handle it.

We can’t handle it because the Scripture doesn’t say that God makes people believe. If it isn’t Scriptural, then I am not going to believe it.

But like I pointed out with Romans 9- it is not human will or exertion, but’s God’s mercy which saves us.

And as I pointed out, our believing (our action not God’s), is not what saves us. Salvation is both the gift and the work of God.

More to come.