Cheryl Schatz

Mark,
You said:

It is quite clear that we are never going to agree since our ‘foundations’ are completely different.

It is certainly clear for me that you are never going to give up your male privilege. But even so it is a good thing for at least there to be understanding of the position. You are the one who consistently says that egals add to or misrepresent the comp position. Now is your chance to clear the air and tell us exactly how the comp view of authority and submission can work out in a definite “men would never be called to do that” example.

Practical implications flow from theology, if the theology is different, the practical issues will be different.

So, let’s see your different practical issue that flows from your theology. Let’s see the comp view in action. That can’t be too hard, can it?

I don’t expect anything i say about my marriage will help facilitate our biblical interpretation of Eph 5.

What an example will do (whether it is from your own marriage or not) will show how the interpretation of Eph 5 works it way out in real life that is consistent with the passage and with the rest of the Bible.

It seems like in an egalitarian context the book of Ephesians could stop at 5:21, since the husband/wife, Christ/church, slave/master, child/parent relationships all say the same thing right- in a nutshell ‘mutual submission’.

Paul gives specific wisdom for each different set of relationships. Each has a unique set of problems that would challenge each one from mutually meeting each other’s needs.

It makes me wonder why Paul would go to all that effort to give these exhortations, if he said it all in 5:21. Wow, my relationship with my wife is no different to the slave and his master- that’s encouraging! (sorry for the sarcasm)

Funny how you put words into our mouths and then make fun of your own words. The fact is that each relationship has its challenges but each relationship is to submit to each other as to Christ. It is our love for Him and our fear of the Lord that encourages us to do what is right even when we feel like we are the privileged one. We are to realize that the Lord Jesus is Master of all and there is no partiality with Him that would make the master as more privileged than the servant or the husband more privileged than the wife or a parent more privileged than a young child believer. No partiality with God means that all are to submit to the needs of the other.

Finally, if my wife IS the body with me, how can she come from my body? How can i be the source of her? Puzzling questions!

She grows from you as her head. You have been set up first so that you take responsibility to care and nurture her and and selflessly meet her needs. That all flows from the head to the body as the head is the source.

I think the reality is, i am not the source of my wife’s body- her parents are (physically).

While only the first man was the physical source of his wife, all mean are to be the source of care. Surely you feel some responsibility to look after your wife and care for her needs. If you feel this responsibility, then you are acting out the head as source application.

Or maybe i am the source ‘spiritually’ like Christ is for the Church.

Only Christ can supply her spiritual needs. He is the only spiritual source. The husband supplies her physical needs. He is the physical source.

Can we draw the conclusion that i am the one responsible for the salvation of my wife, like Christ is for the Church?

One could certainly come to that conclusion if one is a comp. For if the man can take Christ’s authority, then why not take his place as Savior? If the man is to be just like Christ as the comps teach, then where is the line drawing the boundary? I believe that the boundary line is what is in the natural and everything that is a part of God’s duty toward us has nothing to do with the male. Christ’s authority is His right as God.

Now we will wait to see how Mark will bring out the examples of authority/submission with no male taking on any act of submission toward his wife. It will be a huge learning experience to see into the mind of a comp who believes he has a male privilege that God gave him. I will be waiting with baited breath for you to answer Mark. Go ahead. Your turn.