24 Mark,

Cheryl i cant help but feel that you base the comp position on yours and others experience, rather than the bible.

That’s because I don’t see the position in the Bible. The only thing I see is how the comp position works itself out in the lives of its followers. Since I was a comp for most of my marriage and since I have had many women write me over the last 3 years telling me their own experience and I have seen how the teaching has gone beyond the Scripture with the popular complementarian teachers, I have felt great saddness for the hurt that the body of Christ feels over this adding of the comp doctrine to the Scripture.

You refered to seeing “what male rulership looks like even if the intent is benevolent. “- Is this not an argument based on sinful man not scripture. I am truly sorry for the abuse people have faced by mis-use of authority.

This is why Jesus never gives men authority over their wives. We are all sinful and an absolute authority over another member of the body of Christ feeds our sin nature that loves to feel like we are special and have something and someone that we can control. Jesus never gave this kind of control to husbands nor did he take this kind of control over this own sheep when he was here on the earth. Instead he revealed what a godly husband looked like through his loving care and sacrificial attitude. When Jesus was asked to take over the decision-making place because of a dispute between two brothers and their inheritance, Jesus said:

Luk 12:14 But He said to him, “Man, who appointed Me a judge or arbitrator over you?”

Jesus doesn’t make all of our decisions for us and He doesn’t appoint the husband to make all of the decisions for the wife either. We are required to grow up and learn how to be mature Christians who make mature decisions. God will give us wisdom when we ask for it, but He doesn’t treat us as children by making all of our decisions for us so that we don’t have to work at it at all.

I do not see myself as a weak comp, but rather am actually interested in understanding you position and engaging in dialogue rather than just ignoring you.

Ah, a Christian after my own heart! I really appreciate you saying this. This touches at the core of what I believe. We need to work hard to understand each other. We cannot dismiss an argument because of our own preconceived ideas. Once we know what the other person believes, we are able to take that belief and test it by the only straight edge that we have – and that is the Word of God.

If that makes me seem weak, so be it, but i am simply trying to do what you ask of comps-talk to you.

No I don’t see you as “weak” in your belief at all. And I highly respect you for sticking around long enough to listen and give your response. I also do not believe that what you have to say has no value. Each one of us can teach the other and I do not believe that any of us can say that we have no need for the other. You are am important part of the body of Christ and the wisdom that God has given you is of great value.

You said that the christ/church, husband/wife analogy has no authority and is simply tradition. Cheryl how wrong you are! What about Ephesians 23 ff. What is Pauls repsponse in verse 32 – it is PRIMARILY a reflection of Christ and the Church.

Jesus Christ is both God and man. The husband is to reflect the humanity of Christ and His place as “head” but the husband is never given the place as “Lord” or “God” over the wife. I would hope that we can agree on this. Jesus’ place as our kinsman Redeemer is also his place as the husband of the Church. What we can see from his position as husband “head” is that he lifted us up to be with him.

Eph 2:6 and raised us up with Him, and seated us with Him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus,

Then Jesus put all things under our feet! The Scriptures never say that He places the Bride under His feet or that He takes His authority over her. Yes, as God He has great authority over each one of us, but as the human Redeemer, the human Husband of the Bride, He lovingly cares for us and lifts us up. This is what I have been talking about – the husband lifting his bride up – not the husband taking authority over her. As the Bride of Christ we will reign with him. Ruling and reigning means that we need to be mature decision-makers.

And any exegesis which tries to talk about ‘head’ not having any authority is absurd. And im sure you will appeal to not having a ‘plain’ reading of this passage.

I didn’t say that Jesus as God doesn’t have authority. What I am saying is that as husband He doesn’t take authority over His wife. Instead He lifts her up to sit beside Him. Perhaps you can explain the way you see Ephesians 2:6? Also do you see Jesus as placing the church under His feet showing His rule over her as Husband?

One last point. The comp position in NO way encourages abuse or anything of the like. If people think it does, it is purely an indication that they dont understand the comp position very well.

No, I do not think that any of the comp leaders conscientiously encourage abuse. However their application of what they feel is the comp position in the Scriptures gives the husband the power to live out his kingly-rule over his wife in the way that he feels is best for her. Since we are all sinners, the advice for men to rule their wives and take authority over them and make their decisions for them as the ultimate decision-maker of the family has done far more harm than any of them ever imagined.

I am very glad that you are the kind of person that is willing to dialog. That shows your openness not only to examine yourself and your own motives but a willingness to offer correction in a loving and honest way to a sister in Christ. I couldn’t ask more from you than this right now. It is very much appreciated!