Cheryl Schatz

Mark,
Concerning Question #3. I asked you where the Bible says that only elders could teach? I also asked you if single men are in sin for being pastors? You did not answer these questions. I would like you to answer the questions, please.

Let’s see what you did answer:

3. Acts 20 show the responsibility of Elders. They are overseers, they have to keep watch and gurad against false teachers by knowing proper doctrine.

Well, it is interesting that not only is the work of an overseer something that all may strive to according to 1 Timothy 3:1, but also the chapter that you reference above (Acts 20) shows that it is the Holy Spirit who who is the one who makes people overseers.

Act 20:28 “Be on guard for yourselves and for all the flock, among which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to shepherd the church of God which He purchased with His own blood.

When we desire the work of an overseer, it is the Holy Spirit who gives us the ability to do the work as He enables. This is why women can be apologists who work hard at doctrine and the defense of the faith and who expose the lies of the cults and the aberrant movements coming into the church. This is my job. I work hard to protect people and many pastors have come to me for help. Are you now telling us that only men may protect the church and only men may work hard at the teaching of doctrine and exposing error?? Are you telling me that I am in sin because I have been gifted by the Holy Spirit and called into a ministry of protecting the church and teaching doctrine?

You said:

1 Tim 3 is interesting because all the ‘qualifications’ for a elder except for one are personal characteristics. The one exception is that they be ‘able to teach’- a very important responsibility.

1 Timothy 3 is about the work of an overseer (1 Timothy 3:1) and the ability to teach is a very important responsibility. It is a gift given by the Holy Spirit to both men and women. Are you saying that “able to teach” is restricted to men?

Now someone said that the masculine pronouns mean nothing because the bible uses them to refer generically. I totally agree that the bible does such a thing. Interesting though, why isn’t femine pronouns used for generic humanity- is this a hint of the resposibilty of men.

You are “hinting” that men alone are responsible, but that isn’t true. Secondly language comes from a patriarchal society and we do not get “godly hints” from language that God wants only men to teach or protect the flock. This is an extremely weak argument and it presupposes that God should not gift women at certain things because they are “male” only gifts. This is not Biblical.

Now in relation to how this fits 1 Tim 3 lets look closer. We know it can’t mean generic me and women who can be elders because of the various qualifications. For example they are to have ‘one wife’.

Of this disqualifies women and single men, then you have a lot of problems. Do you join any movement that comes against single men as elders and overseers? Do you see them as being in sin?

Also women were Deacons in the early church yet the exact same “qualification” relates to a deacon. How do you explain this?

The “personal qualifications” are rather that of faithfulness to one’s spouse if one is married.

To add to this by verse 11 we are introduced the ‘the women likewise’ which is a clear indication that the verse above are to relate ONLY to men. It is most definitely not generic. Cheryl, i meant 1 Tim 5:17 not 5:7. I apologise for the error.

On the contrary, the “women likewise” shows that the women are NOT to be excluded from the preceding words. The Holy Spirit is showing that women who desire to do the work of an overseer are not missed out. Women must also be faithful spouses and may do the work of an overseer with their qualifications as also personal faithful and upright qualifications. The “women likewise” is a problem to the complementarian position because it says that women are not exempt from 3:1 “desiring to do the work of an overseer”. It supports the egal position and makes the comp position very hard to maintain.

So I will ask you to answer the questions again. Are males who are unmarried sinning against God if they become overseers? Are “women likewise” also allowed to do the work of an overseer as 1 Tim. 3:1 allows? If not, why not? How could we hold back a woman as being in sin but not hold back a single man as being in sin? Please answer these questions, Mark and do not ignore them as you have as they are very, very important questions to us.