Cheryl Schatz

Mark,
You said:

Let me make a proposal because there are some real issues here. Why don’t we slow down and actually look at passages exegetically and in context rather than just proof texting.

After all one cannot claim that we can seek God if Romans 3 is correct that none can (unless of course Romans 3 is not as clear as it seems as you suggest)

I have no problem with going through the Scriptures. But the problem that you mainly have is that you want to hold to a view that causes the rest of the Scriptures to contradict Romans 3. Paul is not adding to the Scriptures. If he was how could we be Bereans? The Bereans were more noble because they checked out Paul’s teaching by the OT Scriptures. If Paul contradicted the OT Scriptures like you believe he did, wow, that would make a real problem about whom to believe.

Likewise one cannot say God has ordained some to salvation and others not, if there are passages which contradict that.

God ordains believers to salvation. There isn’t one Scripture where an unbeliever is ordained to salvation. That is why I asked you. And I am still waiting for even one Scripture where the actual ordaining is of an unbeliever to salvation. Go ahead and prove me wrong if you can.

At least maybe this way we will be more faithful to scripture rather than proof texting all the time, and that way we can slow down a bit and actually discuss the bible, not theologies or presupposed ideas.

Well, my friend, I am the one who kept calling you to the context and showing you where it disagreed with your view. You are the one who tried proof texting. But if it will keep you honest, let’s go for it.

Ill leave it up to you. You can even choose the passage if you want. How’s that!

How about John 6?