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Scripture Commentary tweet 2024-01-19

@FreeThinkerAng @TheMuppetPastor Paul refers to the creation order between Adam and Eve and relates this to the fact that Eve was deceived but Adam was not. Paul is not using this to support relational hierarchy but to hone in on that first deceptio...

@FreeThinkerAng @TheMuppetPastor Paul refers to the creation order between Adam and Eve and relates this to the fact that Eve was deceived but Adam was not. Paul is not using this to support relation

debate
Scripture Commentary tweet 2024-01-05

As @MikeWingerii stated in his video series, how we see Genesis 2-3 is 99% of the debate! Mike sees Paul’s deliberate connection of the creation order with deception, but why isn’t he willing to entertain the idea that Adam wasn’t deceived because o...

As @MikeWingerii stated in his video series, how we see Genesis 2-3 is 99% of the debate! Mike sees Paul’s deliberate connection of the creation order with deception, but why isn’t he willing to ente

debate
Scripture Commentary tweet 2024-01-02

@MarkGrote @Peacemaker811 @HbitsO @BethMooreLPM This assumes authentein means “usurp authority”—are men allowed to do that but women are not? Men are allowed hostile takeovers inspired by geneologies and false understanding of the law? Paul wasn’t ...

@MarkGrote @Peacemaker811 @HbitsO @BethMooreLPM This assumes authentein means “usurp authority”—are men allowed to do that but women are not? Men are allowed hostile takeovers inspired by geneologies

debate
Scripture Commentary tweet 2023-12-24

@9xix113 @JeremiahGofung Deception is tied to the timeline of creation. If you consider Genesis 2 carefully, you will find that God creates some animals in front of Adam and plants and causes to grow plants so that Adam has experience of God creatin...

@9xix113 @JeremiahGofung Deception is tied to the timeline of creation. If you consider Genesis 2 carefully, you will find that God creates some animals in front of Adam and plants and causes to grow

general
Scripture Commentary tweet 2023-12-15

@DST_QA @sympatheticNPC "It was disobeying God by not being a disciple to his wife so that should would fully understand" This is close to what I see the text saying. God gave Adam more experience about Him than Eve and as a result expected him to ...

@DST_QA @sympatheticNPC "It was disobeying God by not being a disciple to his wife so that should would fully understand" This is close to what I see the text saying. God gave Adam more experience a

general
Scripture Commentary tweet 2023-12-15

@kelcy_lowry @chimpchompchamp Misinterpretation of God's word is certainly more common than sand on the seashore these days! However, I don't think the evidence points to Eve misinterpreting or adding to (lying about) what God said. Here's why: 1⃣...

@kelcy_lowry @chimpchompchamp Misinterpretation of God's word is certainly more common than sand on the seashore these days! However, I don't think the evidence points to Eve misinterpreting or addin

debate
Scripture Commentary tweet 2023-12-02

@ronhenzel I did see this before, but after re-reading it, I see that these study notes do catch that salvation from deception due to the false teaching is mentioned. This is good. He does point out the reference back to Gen 3:15, the seed of the w...

@ronhenzel I did see this before, but after re-reading it, I see that these study notes do catch that salvation from deception due to the false teaching is mentioned. This is good. He does point out

Gen 3:15 debate
Scripture Commentary tweet 2023-11-29

@ymmotrojam @3HillsMinor @Rattle_Resists @Kdubtru @michael_ronning Except for si

@ymmotrojam @3HillsMinor @Rattle_Resists @Kdubtru @michael_ronning Except for single women who Paul said shouldn’t seek to get married (1 Cor 7). Are they left lost and in danger of deception because

question
Scripture Commentary tweet 2023-11-29

@ymmotrojam @3HillsMinor @Rattle_Resists @Kdubtru @michael_ronning Adam and Eve were married. Can Paul not use them as prototypes to refer to an unnamed couple which just happens to be repeating a similar deception type of fall? Would Adam have eat...

@ymmotrojam @3HillsMinor @Rattle_Resists @Kdubtru @michael_ronning Adam and Eve were married. Can Paul not use them as prototypes to refer to an unnamed couple which just happens to be repeating a si

question
Scripture Commentary tweet 2023-11-23

@thatlandinotho False teachers and deception is not limited to one biological se

@thatlandinotho False teachers and deception is not limited to one biological sex. That verse in 1 Tim 2:12 has to do with a specific deceived woman teaching false doctrine in the church at Ephesus w

1 Tim 2:12 general
Scripture Commentary tweet 2023-11-20

@DefendTheSheep It’s a pity because after studying these hard passages in more detail we find that Paul wasn’t restricting women at all. His reference to Eve’s deception is only tied to the creation order and not something in her chromosomes. His f...

@DefendTheSheep It’s a pity because after studying these hard passages in more detail we find that Paul wasn’t restricting women at all. His reference to Eve’s deception is only tied to the creation

general
Scripture Commentary tweet 2023-10-03

@elizabethprata @pastorpilgrim @Lily_Warrior @aimeebyrdPYW @JJumping @ajjumping God is also a helper and that doesn’t mean He is underneath our authority. The creation order has to do with deception, not authority. There is no hierarchy displayed i...

@elizabethprata @pastorpilgrim @Lily_Warrior @aimeebyrdPYW @JJumping @ajjumping God is also a helper and that doesn’t mean He is underneath our authority. The creation order has to do with deception,

debate
Scripture Commentary tweet 2023-10-03

@elizabethprata @pastorpilgrim @Lily_Warrior @aimeebyrdPYW @JJumping @ajjumping The creation order has to do with deception, not authority. Adam saw God in the act of creation of plants and animals…and likely Eve, but Eve herself was the last thing ...

@elizabethprata @pastorpilgrim @Lily_Warrior @aimeebyrdPYW @JJumping @ajjumping The creation order has to do with deception, not authority. Adam saw God in the act of creation of plants and animals…a

debate
Scripture Commentary tweet 2023-09-14

@AlphaMasculini1 @godlywomanhood Too bad @godlywomanhood blocked me for explaining the scriptures on this. :-( Deception occurs when you don’t have sufficient experience or knowledge. Yet they both knew the commandment. Eve recounts the words of ...

@AlphaMasculini1 @godlywomanhood Too bad @godlywomanhood blocked me for explaining the scriptures on this. :-( Deception occurs when you don’t have sufficient experience or knowledge. Yet they both

general
Scripture Commentary tweet 2023-09-09

@sleeper_awoke @emilykmay Adam wasn’t deceived because he was created first and observed God creating that tree from the dust..the one that the forbidden fruit came from. Eve didn’t experience that. Her deception doesn’t come from her gender or bec...

@sleeper_awoke @emilykmay Adam wasn’t deceived because he was created first and observed God creating that tree from the dust..the one that the forbidden fruit came from. Eve didn’t experience that.

debate
Scripture Commentary tweet 2023-09-01

@JoshuaSethSchu1 @TheOtherPaul2 @RevKimWChafee @DissidentSouth @_matthewpearson @KinoCineaste My take is close to Marg’s. I think the creation order and deception are related because Adam saw God creating so could not be deceived that the fruit from...

@JoshuaSethSchu1 @TheOtherPaul2 @RevKimWChafee @DissidentSouth @_matthewpearson @KinoCineaste My take is close to Marg’s. I think the creation order and deception are related because Adam saw God cre

general
Scripture Commentary tweet 2023-09-01

@Eric_Conn In that passage, Paul is relating something going on in the church at

@Eric_Conn In that passage, Paul is relating something going on in the church at Ephesus with a specific couple to the prototype in Eden. Deception had to do with lack of experience, not some idea th

general
Scripture Commentary tweet 2023-08-06

@rightresponsem @ChrisHohnholz Paul links the order of first creation with deception. Males can clearly be deceived too, so this isn't a comment about gender differences but relates to the specific creation order of Adam and Eve. Because Adam was c...

@rightresponsem @ChrisHohnholz Paul links the order of first creation with deception. Males can clearly be deceived too, so this isn't a comment about gender differences but relates to the specific c

debate
Scripture Commentary tweet 2023-07-26

@OccamsBraiser @iheartJ37 @MikeWingerii Right, the order of creation is linked to deception. Adam wasn’t deceived because he experienced God in the act of creating (see my post on 1 Tim 2:11-15). There is no law in scripture that says that it is sh...

@OccamsBraiser @iheartJ37 @MikeWingerii Right, the order of creation is linked to deception. Adam wasn’t deceived because he experienced God in the act of creating (see my post on 1 Tim 2:11-15). Th

1 Tim 2:11-15 general
Scripture Commentary tweet 2023-07-26

@Snuggernaut1 @chadlyrose @sovereignbrah You need to read this passage in context and make sense of the grammar. Paul's difficult grammar is because of what he tells Timothy in the first chapter. And the reference to Adam and Eve is not about hiera...

@Snuggernaut1 @chadlyrose @sovereignbrah You need to read this passage in context and make sense of the grammar. Paul's difficult grammar is because of what he tells Timothy in the first chapter. An

debate
Scripture Commentary tweet 2023-07-20

@LauraRicha42528 @_nomadic_soul @DrFrankTurek The only connection with God’s order was deception. At least that’s how Paul parses Gen 1-3 in 1 Tim 2:11-15. It’s not about authority. It’s about a man who had been given knowledge completely failing ...

@LauraRicha42528 @_nomadic_soul @DrFrankTurek The only connection with God’s order was deception. At least that’s how Paul parses Gen 1-3 in 1 Tim 2:11-15. It’s not about authority. It’s about a ma

1 Tim 2:11-15 debate
Scripture Commentary tweet 2023-06-15

@DanielFarey @MattSwiftyPerry 3/ And because he had this experience, God expected him to help Eve understand the deception and protect her. The 'she' in v15 is an anaphoric reference back to 'a woman' because Eve cannot be saved future tense. The '...

@DanielFarey @MattSwiftyPerry 3/ And because he had this experience, God expected him to help Eve understand the deception and protect her. The 'she' in v15 is an anaphoric reference back to 'a woman

general
Scripture Commentary tweet 2023-06-14

@ymmotrojam @brmorris @CherylSchatz But if the apex of creation is last one created, that would mean the woman is the apex. I think we have to stick with what Paul relates. The creation order has something to do with deception. And we all know bot...

@ymmotrojam @brmorris @CherylSchatz But if the apex of creation is last one created, that would mean the woman is the apex. I think we have to stick with what Paul relates. The creation order has so

debate
Scripture Commentary tweet 2023-06-13

@ymmotrojam @brmorris @CherylSchatz The questions to be answered are: 1/ what does the creation order have to do with deception, and 2/ are there any authority of the man over the woman conveyed by those present (God, Adam, Eve, the Serpent). No one...

@ymmotrojam @brmorris @CherylSchatz The questions to be answered are: 1/ what does the creation order have to do with deception, and 2/ are there any authority of the man over the woman conveyed by th

debate
Scripture Commentary tweet 2023-06-11

@LauralovsJesus @cpa_dallas @HwsEleutheroi The reason is given as 1/ Adam was formed first and 2/ Adam was not deceived but Eve was (though he was beside her). So the order and deception are related. This couple in Ephesus had a similar situation, ...

@LauralovsJesus @cpa_dallas @HwsEleutheroi The reason is given as 1/ Adam was formed first and 2/ Adam was not deceived but Eve was (though he was beside her). So the order and deception are related.

debate
Theology verse entry

1 Timothy 2:11-15

Sections: cross_references, debate_points, exegesis, greek_analysis

1 Timothy 2:11-15 specific woman,deception,authenteo,grammar,perfect tense,future tense,anaphoric,egalitarian,ephesus,teknogonia,singular plural,historical perfect,verbal aspect,paul as pattern
Theology verse entry

1 Timothy 1:13-16

Sections: cross_references, exegesis, greek_analysis

1 Timothy 1:13-16 mercy,ignorance,pattern,hybristEs,paul,blasphemer,persecutor,violent aggressor,deception,egalitarian,restoration
Theology verse entry

Philippians 1:15-18

Sections: cross_references, debate_points, exegesis, greek_analysis

Philippians 1:15-18 teaching,motive,truth,preaching,paul,egalitarian,complementarian
Theology verse entry

Genesis 1:26-28

Sections: cross_references, debate_points, exegesis, greek_analysis

Genesis 1:26-28 creation,dominion,co-equal,image of God,male and female,egalitarian,gender roles,imago dei,equality
Theology verse entry

Genesis 2:15-20

Sections: cross_references, debate_points, exegesis, greek_analysis

Genesis 2:15-20 garden,guard,ezer,helper,creation order,egalitarian,woman,ezer kenegdo,naming animals,no counterpart,strength
Theology verse entry

Romans 5:12-19

Sections: debate_points, exegesis, greek_analysis

Romans 5:12-19 original sin,Adam,last Adam,representative,federal headship,sin through one man,egalitarian
Theology verse entry

Hosea 6:7

Sections: exegesis

Hosea 6:7 Adam,treachery,treason,covenant,faithless,egalitarian
Theology verse entry

Colossians 3:9-10

Sections: exegesis, greek_analysis

Colossians 3:9-10 old man,new self,sin nature,circumcision of heart,renewal,egalitarian
Theology verse entry

Ezekiel 33:1-6

Sections: exegesis

Ezekiel 33:1-6 watchman,warning,accountability,silence,trumpet,blood guilt,Adam parallel
Theology verse entry

Genesis 3:14-19

Sections: cross_references, debate_points, exegesis, greek_analysis

Genesis 3:14-19 fall,curse,consequences,serpent,Eve,Adam,pain,thorns,death,not prescriptive,protoevangelium,seed of the woman,Messiah,teknogonia,desire,rule,teshuqah,mashal,egalitarian,complementarian,patriarchy
Theology verse entry

1 Timothy 2:1-7

Sections: cross_references, debate_points, exegesis, greek_analysis

1 Timothy 2:1-7 prayer,intercession,one mediator,ransom,antilytron,false teaching,Ephesus,universalism of scope,paraggelia,herald,apostle,teacher,egalitarian,soteriology,atonement,unlimited atonement,Calvinism,mediation
Theology verse entry

1 Timothy 2:8-10

Sections: cross_references, debate_points, exegesis, greek_analysis

1 Timothy 2:8-10 prayer,men,women,anger,dissension,modesty,good works,kosmios,sophrosyne,aidos,likewise,Ephesus,false teaching,egalitarian,plural to singular transition
Theology verse entry

Genesis 3:1-7

Sections: cross_references, debate_points, exegesis, greek_analysis

Genesis 3:1-7 temptation,fall,serpent,deception,sin,silence of adam
Theology verse entry

1 Corinthians 14:33-37

Sections: cross_references, debate_points, exegesis, greek_analysis

1 Corinthians 14:33-37 interpolation,textual criticism,silence,quotation,Western text,women speaking,women silent,Corinthian quotation,oral law,Pharisees,rhetorical refutation,eta particle,women in ministry,egalitarian,complementarian debate
Theology greek term

τεκνογονία (teknogonia)

the childbearing

greek
Theology greek term

αὐθεντέω (authenteo)

to domineer / to usurp authority

greek
Theology greek term

ὑποτύπωσις (hupotyposis)

pattern, prototype, example, outline

greek
Theology greek term

וַיִּקְטֹל (wayyiqtol)

consecutive/sequential narrative verb form (Hebrew)

greek
Theology greek term

αὐτοδικεῖν (autodikein)

to plead one's own cause; to act as one's own advocate (Attic Greek equivalent of authentein)

greek
Mike Winger idea 2022-03-14

Schreiner appeals to 1 Timothy 2:14 ('Adam was not deceived, but the woman was deceived') to support point 5 -- Mike thinks the verse can be explained without the subversion-of-authority reading.

NT support for serpent-targeting-Eve argument

Tom Schreiner 1 Tim 2:14 Eve's deception
Mike Winger idea 2024-03-01

1 Timothy 2:12-13 is based on creation, not the fall or cultural circumstances

Mike emphasizes the creational basis for the elder restriction.

1 Timothy 2:13 creation order 1 Timothy 2:13 women and deception
Mike Winger idea 2023-11-22

Eve's deception (1 Tim 2:14): does NOT mean women are more easily deceived

Mike strongly rejects the interpretation that Paul cites Eve's deception to argue women are inherently more susceptible to deception.

Genesis 3 1 Timothy 2:14 complementarian correction Genesis 3 1 Timothy 2:14
Mike Winger idea 2023-11-22

Genesis 2-3 is already in Paul's mind, making Genesis 3:15 the natural next reference

Mike argues that Paul's appeal to Genesis in vv.13-14 makes a Genesis 3:15 reference in v.15 perfectly natural.

Genesis 2 Genesis 3 Genesis 3:15 Genesis 2 Genesis 3 Genesis 3:15
Mike Winger idea 2023-11-22

Conclusion 14: Eve's deception does NOT mean women are more easily deceived

Mike forcefully rejects the misogynistic reading of v.14.

1 Timothy 2:14 complementarian correction 1 Timothy 2:14 women and deception
Mike Winger idea 2018-01-31

Deuteronomy 18: the test for a false prophet — a prophet who speaks in God's name what God has not commanded shall die

Scriptural framework for evaluating false prophecy

Deuteronomy 18:20 Deuteronomy false prophet Joseph Smith Deuteronomy 18:20
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