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soft complementarianism complementarianism egalitarianism

Five egalitarian arguments previewed; first two are weak, last three are stronger

Mike previews the five arguments he will cover: persecution, rabbi-training, universal priesthood, prophecy, and spiritual gifts. He says the first two are weak but the last three challenged him and offer corrections for complementarians.

spiritual gifts argument teaching gift leadership gift

Argument 5 preview: God gifts women with teaching and leadership, so they should be able to use those gifts fully

Mike says this argument challenged him the most. If the Holy Spirit gives women gifts of teaching and leadership, restricting those gifts contradicts God's purposes.

1 Corinthians 11:17-34 1 Corinthians 12-14 1 Corinthians 14:3-4 1 Corinthians 11:17-34 1 Corinthians 12-14 1 Corinthians 14:3-4

Broader context of 1 Corinthians 11-14 confirms it is about gathered worship: Lord's Supper and spiritual gifts in church

Mike appeals to the wider literary context to confirm his reading.

spiritual gifts argument teaching gift leadership gift

Argument 5 introduced: The spiritual gifts argument — God gifts women with the same gifts as men

Mike introduces the fifth and final argument, which he considers the strongest of the day.

1 Corinthians 12:7 Philip Payne spiritual gifts argument 1 Corinthians 12:7

Philip Payne's two-part argument: complementarians either assume God never gives women certain gifts OR they wrongly restrict those gifts

Mike presents Philip Payne's formulation of the gifts argument.

Romans 12:6-8 spiritual gifts teaching gift leadership gift

Romans 12:6-8 — teaching and leading are listed as spiritual gifts alongside gifts women clearly have

Mike examines the gifts list in Romans 12 to determine whether women can have teaching and leadership gifts.

Ephesians 4:11-12 offices vs. gifts Ephesians 4:11-12 pastor-teacher

Ephesians 4:11-12 is about offices (apostles, prophets, evangelists, shepherds/teachers) not about gifts applicable to the question

Mike examines Ephesians 4 but determines it is about offices, not gifts.

1 Peter 4:10-11 spiritual gifts 1 Peter 4:10-11

1 Peter 4:10-11 — 'whoever speaks' includes all speaking gifts and all are meant to be used

Mike cites 1 Peter to show gifts are meant to be used, not kept dormant.

apostles spiritual gifts offices vs. gifts

Gifts do not seem gender-specific; leadership and teaching could be gifts women have

Mike's conclusion on the first part of the gifts argument.

Romans 12:6-8 spiritual gifts Romans 12:6-8

Romans 12:6-8 revisited — women were in every gift category except teaching/leading; it is arbitrary to exclude them from those two

Mike restates the argument from Romans 12 more explicitly.

spiritual gifts argument gifts expressed outside eldership

Egalitarian claim that women are 'kept from serving God according to their gifting' is wrong — most gifted teachers are not elders

Mike rebuts the claim that restricting eldership means restricting women's gifts.

Discovering Biblical Equality spiritual gifts argument Stanley Grenz

Stanley Grenz argues 'the integral relation between gifts and ministry' means the church must give place for the giftedness of all persons

Mike quotes another egalitarian scholar's version of the gifts argument.

eldership spiritual gifts argument

Summary of gifts argument: women likely have teaching/leadership gifts, no scripture limits those gifts by gender, but limitations are on who can be an elder specifically

Mike summarizes his conclusions from the gifts argument.

spiritual gifts argument eldership qualifications gender-based restriction

Why gifts do not translate to eldership: (1) one can teach and lead outside eldership; (2) the restriction is gender-based, not gift-based; (3) gifting alone cannot be sufficient for appointment

Mike gives three reasons why the gifts argument fails to establish women as elders.

eldership spiritual gifts argument women teaching

Video summary — Argument 5: Women can teach and lead but should find expression outside the role of elder

Summary of the gifts argument.

cessationism continuationism

Mike is not a cessationist — he believes prophecy still occurs today

Mike briefly states his position on the continuation of spiritual gifts.

Mike Winger idea 2022-03-28

Preview of NT topics: Were women apostles, elders, deacons, teachers? Do female prophets mean women can be elders? Does God's gifting of women mean no role restrictions?

Preview of upcoming content

spiritual gifts prophetess women apostles

Mike Winger idea 2022-12-04

Judging Prophecy Hinge 1: Was testing prophecy a real practice in the early church?

Mike establishes that testing/judging prophecy was indeed a regular church practice.

1 John 4:1 1 Corinthians 12:10 1 John 4:1 testing prophecy 1 Corinthians 12:10

Mike Winger idea 2024-03-01

Women having influence is not a problem — influence is not the same as eldership

Mike distinguishes between influence and elder authority.

Romans 12 Deborah Junia Priscilla

Bill Johnson Kris Vallotton salvation

Mike's charitable assessment: he believes Bill Johnson and Kris Vallotton are probably saved, and that real miracles and healings do come from the movement

Mike establishes a baseline of charitable Christian evaluation before critique

Bill Johnson spiritual gifts prophecy

How Bill Johnson started the prophetic in Weaverville: asking people around a table 'what do you think Jesus would say?' then declaring they had just prophesied

Mike plays a direct video clip of Johnson explaining his methodology for launching the prophetic ministry

spiritual gifts Bethel School of Supernatural Ministry social engineering

Bethel's prophetic training exercise: pair off, give a 'word of knowledge' about your partner, then celebrate whether right or wrong — the goal is creating a risk-taking culture, not accurate prophecy

Mike plays a video of a Bethel training session to show how prophetic culture is manufactured

Bethel Church spiritual gifts social engineering

Bethel's prophetic culture is social engineering — a formula developed through experimentation and exported to other churches worldwide

Mike's meta-level analysis of what Bethel is doing with prophecy

Bethel Church spiritual gifts revival

Closing exhortation: don't pull back from healing, prophecy, or the Spirit because of Bethel's errors — the hunger of their movement reveals a real need the church should meet genuinely

Mike's closing remarks

Mike Winger idea 2018-01-31

Upcoming video topic: exposing false teaching within charismatic Christianity — abuse of the spiritual gifts framework

Preview of future content on charismatic abuse

Mike Winger spiritual gifts apologetics

Mike Winger idea 2018-09-05

Modern prophecy is not equivalent to Scripture: not all prophecy becomes canonical; personal/local words from God are not universal obligations on the whole church.

Viewer question about whether modern-day prophecy is as authoritative as Scripture.

revelation spiritual gifts prophecy revelation

Mike Winger idea 2019-02-07

Face-to-face with God as the referent of "the perfect" in 1 Corinthians 13

Mike elaborates on why "the perfect" refers to the eternal state, using the internal logic of 1 Corinthians 13.

1 Corinthians 13:11-12 spiritual gifts eschatology cessationism

Mike Winger idea 2019-03-13

Tongues in the New Testament: multiple types — tongues with interpretation (public) and tongues without interpretation (private).

Tanya Baltzer asks about tongues — actual languages vs. unknown languages.

1 Corinthians 14 Acts 2 (Pentecost) 1 Corinthians 13:1 1 Corinthians 14 Tongues Acts 2 (Pentecost)

1 Corinthians 13:10-12 cessationism continuationism spiritual gifts

1 Corinthians 13:10-12 is the primary cessationist proof-text in the cessationism vs. continuationism debate.

Introduction to the episode. Winger frames the central question: does 1 Cor 13:10-12 teach that tongues, prophecy, and knowledge ceased after the apostolic era?

cessationism continuationism spiritual gifts

Cessationism defined: miraculous gifts belonged to the apostolic era only, served a unique founding purpose, and ceased before the canon closed.

Winger reads a definition from Theapedia. He contrasts it with continuationism, which holds the gifts are normative and available today.

1 Corinthians 12-14 1 Corinthians 13:8-13 1 Corinthians 12-14 prophecy word of knowledge

1 Corinthians 13:8-13 in context: the love passage is embedded within 1 Cor 12-14, a sustained section on spiritual gifts.

Winger reads the passage aloud (1 Cor 13:8-13) and establishes its literary context before presenting cessationist interpretations.

1 Corinthians 13:8 spiritual gifts prophecy word of knowledge

Verse-by-verse: v. 8 — love never ends; three gifts (prophecy, knowledge, tongues) will pass away; the context is clearly the spiritual gifts of 1 Cor 12-14.

Winger begins his own positive verse-by-verse treatment of 1 Cor 13:8-13.

1 Corinthians 13:13 spiritual gifts love 1 Corinthians 13:13

Main point of 1 Cor 13: love, not gifts, is the permanent priority; pursuit of love must exceed pursuit of spiritual gifts.

Winger concludes the exegesis by restating Paul's actual primary argument.

apostolic office cessationism continuationism

Winger's own position: open but not normative — he agrees with cessationists on apostleship and a likely reduction of healing gifts, but rejects full cessationism.

Having refuted the cessationist use of 1 Cor 13, Winger clarifies his own nuanced view to avoid being read as a rampant charismatic.

Matthew 18 Matthew 18 Bethel Church Bethel School of Supernatural Ministry

Critique of Bethel School of Supernatural Ministry: prophetic activation exercises using Uno cards reduce prophecy to social engineering and fabrication.

Winger pivots to critique hyper-charismatic practice, using Bethel's published school curriculum as a concrete example.

1 Corinthians 12-14 1 Corinthians 12-14 cessationism continuationism

The cure for hyper-charismatic abuse is not cessationism but the biblical regulative norms already given in 1 Cor 12-14 for how gifts function in the church.

Winger resists the reactionary move of becoming cessationist in response to charismatic excess.

continuationism spiritual gifts prophecy

Personal testimony: Winger reports a small number of personal experiences he believes were genuine prophetic insights that subsequently proved true.

Winger offers experiential (not dogmatic) support for remaining open to the gifts.

1 Corinthians 14 Romans 8 1 Corinthians 13:1 1 Corinthians 14 Romans 8 spiritual gifts

Q&A: Tongues in 1 Cor 14 are actual languages; tongues always requires genuine linguistic communication; "groaning" in Romans 8 is distinct from the gift of tongues.

Response to viewer question about whether 1 Cor 14 tongues are languages or ecstatic utterances.

continuationism church order spiritual gifts

Winger's church practice: open to Spirit-prompted words but does not structure services around spiritual gifts; anti-normative posture.

Q&A response about how gifts function in his church.

biblical authority cessationism continuationism

Views on gifts are often driven more by experience than Scripture; the exegetical case against cessationism from 1 Cor 13 is strong but trajectory arguments for cessationism are weak.

Q&A — viewer asks whether people's positions on sign gifts are experience-based more than Scripture-based.

Craig Keener spiritual gifts healing

Resource recommendation for documented modern miracles: Craig Keener's two-volume work "Miracles" provides medical/testimonial evidence catalogued by a respected scholar.

Q&A — viewer asks for visible evidence that gifts of healing are active today.