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Mike Winger idea 2022-05-30

Five egalitarian arguments previewed; first two are weak, last three are stronger

Mike previews the five arguments he will cover: persecution, rabbi-training, universal priesthood, prophecy, and spiritual gifts. He says the first two are weak but the last three challenged him and offer corrections for complementarians.

soft complementarianism complementarianism egalitarianism

Mike Winger idea 2022-05-30

Argument 1 detail: N.T. Wright's persecution argument from 'Surprised by Scripture'

Wright quotes Kenneth Bailey's cultural analysis to argue that women being targeted by Saul's persecution proves they were leaders and influential figures in the community.

Acts 8 N.T. Wright Surprised by Scripture Acts 8

Mike Winger idea 2022-05-30

Mike covers N.T. Wright because many viewers said Wright influenced their egalitarian views

Mike explains he is covering Wright's arguments not because many scholars make them, but because viewers told him Wright was the reason they became egalitarian.

Five egalitarian arguments previewed; first two are weak, last three are stronger

Argument 1 detail: N.T. Wright's persecution argument from 'Surprised by Scripture'

Mike covers N.T. Wright because many viewers said Wright influenced their egalitarian views

A third option Wright did not consider: learning theology deeply without becoming a rabbi

The egalitarian move 'prophecy involves teaching, therefore all teaching is acceptable, therefore prophecy equals eldership' blurs God-given distinctions

Keener himself acknowledges prophets had 'no authority outside of their message'

Argument 5 introduced: The spiritual gifts argument — God gifts women with the same gifts as men

Romans 12:6-8 — teaching and leading are listed as spiritual gifts alongside gifts women clearly have

Mike's personal example: he served as youth pastor for 13 years and never functioned as senior pastor, yet his gifts were not limited

Second part of gifts argument: Philip Payne says gifts are 'for the common good' so you cannot restrict who a woman teaches

Titus 2:3-5 — older women are to teach younger women; a biblical case for women's teaching ministry outside eldership

Not everyone who teaches is an elder — an elder must be able to teach, but ability to teach does not require eldership

Colossians 3:16 — mutual teaching applies to all believers including women; Priscilla corrected Apollos

Egalitarian claim that women are 'kept from serving God according to their gifting' is wrong — most gifted teachers are not elders

Grenz presumes (1) teaching and leadership can only find true expression in eldership — Mike disagrees

Why gifts do not translate to eldership: (1) one can teach and lead outside eldership; (2) the restriction is gender-based, not gift-based; (3) gifting alone cannot be sufficient for appointment

Video summary — Argument 4: Women can prophesy in mixed gatherings but prophecy is radically different from eldership

Video summary — Argument 5: Women can teach and lead but should find expression outside the role of elder

Introduction of Galatians 3:28 as the egalitarian 'silver bullet' verse

Definition of the two sides: complementarian and egalitarian

Series recap: Videos 5-6 and complementarians also receiving correction

Mike's personal journey: wanted to become egalitarian but became more strongly complementarian

Westfall's translation of Galatians 3:26-29 and 'sonship status' rendering

The whole debate hinges on how far 'sonship status' can be stretched

The original context: judaizers challenging sonship status of Gentiles, slaves, and women

Westfall's 'out-group status' argument: excluding women from eldership communicates they are outsiders

The assumption that limiting women inherently wrongs women bypasses Scripture

Westfall's equivalence claim: male/female parallels Jew/Greek in the same ways

Galatians 2 is about being treated as outside Christ, not as second-class citizens within Christ

Internal contradiction between egalitarian camps: cultural restrictions vs. status-in-Christ arguments

Egalitarian pushback: Mike treats the male/female pair differently than Jew/Gentile and slave/free

Correction for complementarians: do not treat women as a lower class of Christian

Contemporary relevance: SBC debate on women in leadership

Philip Payne's claim about Galen is factually false — Galen affirmed the brain controls cognition and willed action

Pierce and Groothuis's claim that Paul 'only reinforces source/provision' is contradicted by the biblical evidence

Ephesians 5:22-24 explicitly uses 'submit' and 'be subject to' in the context of headship

Wayne Grudem's response articles — thorough rebuttal of egalitarian lexical claims

Peter Glare, editor of the LSJ, writes to Grudem agreeing with his conclusions — 'the supposed sense source of course does not exist'

Mike's assessment: egalitarian scholarship on kephale is propped up with misinformation

Proverbs 31 woman as model of wife with real authority and independence

Davids claims 1 Peter 2:13 makes family a 'human institution' like government

Davids sees 'holy women approved by God' as merely cultural approval, which contradicts the text

Red flag: claiming Paul uses a word differently than everyone in his culture understood it

Real believers exist on both sides, but the issue still matters.

Summary of video 1: removing obstacles and presuppositions that cause people to bypass the Bible on this topic.

The worst complementarian approach is to ignore OT women; egalitarians tend to maximize and stretch the data, exemplified by Linda Belleville.

Aimee Byrd claims Huldah canonized the Torah by her prophecy — Mike calls this utterly ridiculous stretching.

Linda Belleville's view on Miriam from the Two Views on Women in Ministry book.

The Numbers 12 passage is actually about God rebuking Miriam for usurping Moses's authority, not about her valued leadership.

Israel traveled by divine command (cloud and fire), never by democracy — refuting the claim that the people 'refused' to travel without Miriam.

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