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Mike Winger idea 2022-04-13

Belleville stretches by claiming women are 'readily labeled deacons' -- pluralizing a single case

Mike critiques Belleville's overstatement about Phoebe.

Linda Belleville Two Views on Women in Ministry Phoebe
Mike Winger idea 2022-04-13

Belleville's footnote 61 sources examined: 1 Corinthians 16:15-18 -- no women deacons found

Mike checks Belleville's first footnoted verse for her 'readily labeled' claim.

1 Corinthians 16:15-18 Linda Belleville diakonia 1 Corinthians 16:15-18
Mike Winger idea 2022-04-13

Belleville's second footnote: 2 Corinthians 8:18-24 -- all males, no deacons, no women

Mike checks the second footnoted passage.

2 Corinthians 8:18-24 Linda Belleville scholarly methodology 2 Corinthians 8:18-24
Mike Winger idea 2022-04-13

Belleville's third footnote: Philippians 2:19-30 -- all males, no women deacons

Mike checks the third footnoted passage.

Philippians 2:19-30 Linda Belleville Discovering Biblical Equality scholarly methodology
Mike Winger idea 2022-04-13

Philip Payne's claim: Phoebe was Paul's personal leader based on 'prostatis' in Romans 16:2

Mike examines an extraordinary claim about Phoebe's role.

Romans 16:2 Philip Payne Phoebe prostatis
Mike Winger idea 2022-04-13

LSJ vs. BDAG on prostatis: wrong lexicon used; BDAG says 'patron/benefactor,' not 'leader'

Mike identifies a significant lexical error in Payne's argument.

Philip Payne prostatis LSJ lexicon
Mike Winger idea 2022-04-13

Survey of 12 translations on prostatis: all say patron/helper/benefactor; only Passion Translation says 'leader'

Mike checks major English translations to see if any support Payne's reading.

Romans 16:2 Philip Payne Phoebe prostatis
Mike Winger idea 2022-04-13

1 Timothy 3:8-13: deacon requirements with the key question of verse 11 -- wives or women deacons?

Mike turns to the definitive passage on deacon qualifications.

1 Timothy 3:11 1 Timothy 3:8-13 women deacons 1 Timothy 3:11 1 Timothy 3:8-13
Mike Winger idea 2022-04-13

Argument for women deacons: the word 'likewise' creates a three-part structure (elders, deacons, women)

Mike builds the case for reading verse 11 as female deacons.

1 Timothy 3:11 women deacons 1 Timothy 3:11 hosautos (likewise)
Mike Winger idea 2022-04-13

'Faithful in all things' as a catch-all summarizing remaining deacon requirements for women

Mike explains why the women's requirements are slightly shorter.

1 Timothy 3:11 women deacons 1 Timothy 3:11 faithful in all things
Mike Winger idea 2022-04-13

Key argument: elder's wives have no requirements, but deacon's wives do -- because they're ministry participants

Mike presents what he considers a strong argument for women deacons.

1 Timothy 3:1-7 1 Timothy 3:11 women deacons 1 Timothy 3:1-7 1 Timothy 3:11
Mike Winger idea 2022-04-13

The word 'deaconess' didn't exist yet; Paul used 'gunaikas' because no feminine term was available

Mike explains why Paul didn't use a feminine deacon term.

1 Timothy 3:11 church history 1 Timothy 3:11 diakonos
Mike Winger idea 2022-04-13

Craig Blomberg on early church deaconesses: common for centuries with pastoral care and baptism roles

Mike cites historical support for women deacons.

Two Views on Women in Ministry Craig Blomberg deaconess history
Mike Winger idea 2022-04-13

Mike's nuanced conclusion: women were functional deaconesses, possibly wives of deacons serving alongside them

Mike states his final position on women deacons.

1 Timothy 3:11 1 Corinthians 7 women deacons Phoebe 1 Timothy 3:11
Mike Winger idea 2022-04-13

Egalitarian contradiction: if 1 Timothy 3:11 has women deacons, it proves women are excluded from elders in 3:1-7

Mike identifies an internal contradiction in egalitarian argumentation.

1 Timothy 3:1-7 1 Timothy 3:11 women deacons internal contradiction eldership
Mike Winger idea 2022-04-13

Preview of upcoming topics: apostles, universal priesthood, prophecy, spiritual gifts, NT Wright's arguments

Mike previews what will be covered in part 5.

women apostles N.T. Wright women prophets
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-09

Series overview: Were women apostles in the New Testament?

Mike introduces part 5 of the Women in Ministry series, focused on the claim that women were apostles.

complementarianism egalitarianism women as apostles
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-09

Apostle must mean highest leadership for egalitarian argument to work

Mike emphasizes a key logical requirement of the egalitarian argument.

apostolic authority apostolos
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-09

The word apostolos has a range of meanings in Greek

Mike explains the semantic range of 'apostle' as groundwork for the next argument.

Romans 16:7 apostolos Romans 16:7 semantic range
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-09

Option 1: Junia as highest-sense apostle (like Peter or Paul)

Mike examines the strongest possible egalitarian reading.

Romans 16:7 Junia apostolic authority Romans 16:7
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-09

Craig Blomberg's soft complementarian view: missionaries with temporary authority

Mike presents Blomberg's nuanced position from Two Views on Women in Ministry.

soft complementarianism Two Views on Women in Ministry Craig Blomberg
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-09

Women were missionaries in the early church; 'co-workers' means missionary partners

Mike affirms women's roles in early church missions.

co-workers in Paul women in missions Paul's missionary teams
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-09

The egalitarian 'trump card' of Junia as apostle does not work

Mike's interim conclusion before moving to the Greek syntactical argument.

1 Timothy 2 Junia 1 Timothy 2 egalitarian trump card
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-09

Mike identifies equivocation in Wright's argument about apostle

Mike charges Wright with a logical fallacy.

Mary Magdalene N.T. Wright equivocation fallacy
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-09

The office of apostle involves more than witnessing the resurrection

Mike distinguishes the office of apostle from mere witness.

1 Corinthians Mary Magdalene apostolic office apostolic commission
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-09

Craig Keener's argument: Deborah as an Old Testament apostle equivalent

Mike addresses Keener's claim linking Deborah to apostleship.

Judges Deborah Judges Craig Keener
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-09

Mike's conclusion: no female apostles in the official high-leadership sense

Mike summarizes the positive data section.

women as apostles apostolic office egalitarian arguments refuted
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-09

Negative data: all twelve apostles were men

Mike presents the complementarian argument from the composition of the Twelve.

Craig Blomberg elder restriction the Twelve
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-09

Unfalsifiability problem: can we distinguish God's design from cultural accommodation?

Mike challenges the egalitarian method at its core.

cultural accommodation unfalsifiable theory God's design for leadership
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-30

Argument 1 preview: The persecution argument from N.T. Wright

Mike introduces the first argument: N.T. Wright claims that Paul persecuting women (Acts 8) proves women were leaders in the early church.

Acts 8 N.T. Wright Acts 8 persecution argument
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-30

Argument 2 preview: Jesus training women to be rabbis, not just disciples

The claim that Mary sitting at Jesus's feet (Luke 10) is a technical phrase meaning rabbinical training, implying Jesus intended women for eldership-level leadership.

Luke 10:39 N.T. Wright Luke 10:39 Mary and Martha
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-30

Argument 5 preview: God gifts women with teaching and leadership, so they should be able to use those gifts fully

Mike says this argument challenged him the most. If the Holy Spirit gives women gifts of teaching and leadership, restricting those gifts contradicts God's purposes.

spiritual gifts argument teaching gift leadership gift
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-30

Argument 1 detail: N.T. Wright's persecution argument from 'Surprised by Scripture'

Wright quotes Kenneth Bailey's cultural analysis to argue that women being targeted by Saul's persecution proves they were leaders and influential figures in the community.

Acts 8 N.T. Wright Surprised by Scripture Acts 8
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-30

Wright's claim that women were persecuted 'equally' with men is an overstatement

Mike analyzes Wright's specific wording. While both men and women were imprisoned, we have no data on whether persecution was truly equal in degree or severity.

N.T. Wright persecution argument
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-30

Acts 26:9-11 shows Paul persecuted 'many of the saints,' not leaders specifically

Mike reads Acts 26:9-11 where Paul describes persecuting 'many of the saints,' punishing them 'in every synagogue,' and compelling them to blaspheme.

Acts 26:9-11 persecution argument Acts 26:9-11 Paul/Saul
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-30

Acts 8:1 — all believers scattered except the apostles, showing persecution targeted non-leaders

The persecution resulted in everyone fleeing Jerusalem except the apostles. If persecution targeted leaders, the non-leaders should have stayed.

Acts 8:1 persecution argument Acts 8:1
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-30

Stephen was a deacon, not a high leader, yet he was stoned

Stephen's martyrdom further undermines the claim that persecution targeted only high leaders.

Acts 8 Stephen Acts 8 deacon
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-30

Acts 8:3 — Saul went house to house dragging off men and women; this was general persecution, not targeting leaders

Mike reads Acts 8:3 which is the actual text Wright bases his argument on. Paul went to every house interrogating whether people were Christians.

Acts 8:3 persecution argument Acts 8:3
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-30

Conclusion on persecution argument: being persecuted proves you are a Christian, not a leader

Mike's conclusion: the NT context never says persecution implies important leadership. It just implies being a Christian.

persecution argument
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-30

Argument 3 introduced: Universal priesthood of believers

Mike introduces the argument: since all NT believers are priests, and priestly functions include teaching and leading, women should be able to be elders.

eldership universal priesthood of believers
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-30

Grenz: the NT parallel to Levitical priesthood is the church as a whole, not ordained leaders

Grenz argues that the priesthood of all believers means the parallel to OT priests is all Christians, not just clergy.

Discovering Biblical Equality universal priesthood of believers Stanley Grenz
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-30

Arguments that current leadership is priestly in character are bad, but we can learn something from an all-male OT priesthood

Mike rejects the priestly-character-of-eldership argument but says there may still be relevant principles from the all-male Levitical priesthood.

eldership Levitical priesthood
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-30

Grenz's positive case: whoever is a priest should be able to be an elder

After Grenz dismantles the complementarian argument, he builds his own: women are priests, therefore they can be elders.

Discovering Biblical Equality universal priesthood of believers Stanley Grenz
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-30

Grenz argues the Spirit's sovereign call and gifting, not gender, determines who can be an elder

Grenz's more detailed argument: since the Spirit calls believer-priests to ministry, gender cannot be an overriding disqualifying factor.

1 Corinthians 12:7 Discovering Biblical Equality Stanley Grenz 1 Corinthians 12:7
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-30

Correction for complementarians: the husband is NOT the priest of his home

Mike disagrees with many complementarians, including pastors he has respected, on this point.

headship universal priesthood of believers complementarian correction
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-30

Complementarian claim that women only prophesied privately is an error

Some complementarians argue women had private prophetic revelation but never prophesied publicly.

Deborah Huldah Barak
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-30

Eldership is radically different from prophecy: anyone could prophesy instantly, but elders must meet extensive qualifications

Mike begins a detailed list of differences between prophecy and eldership.

1 Timothy 3 Titus 1 1 Timothy 3 eldership qualifications Titus 1
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-30

Prophecy is tested; the prophet has no authority over the evaluation of their own prophecy

Mike explains the testing process for prophecy per 1 Corinthians 14:29 and 1 John 4:1.

1 Corinthians 14:29 1 John 4:1 prophecy and authority 1 Corinthians 14:29 1 John 4:1
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-30

Argument 5 introduced: The spiritual gifts argument — God gifts women with the same gifts as men

Mike introduces the fifth and final argument, which he considers the strongest of the day.

spiritual gifts argument teaching gift leadership gift
Mike Winger idea 2022-05-30

Philip Payne's two-part argument: complementarians either assume God never gives women certain gifts OR they wrongly restrict those gifts

Mike presents Philip Payne's formulation of the gifts argument.

1 Corinthians 12:7 Philip Payne spiritual gifts argument 1 Corinthians 12:7