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Mark, > This is a massive debate which we have barely touched on, so i hope you can appreciate why i had to probe your view since it was producing a contradiction in the word. But it is good to see y

Hi everyone, Curious as to whom to believe – egalitarians or complementarists – I begun a research four years ago. I found that despite all the fancy rhetoric and emotional appeals, modern complemen

Mark, I missed your Bible references on your post. Sorry. I have been copying and pasting sections for comment and for some reason I must have been interrupted and didn’t finish reading that one post

Mark, > Cheryl, i agree 100% with the following… > > “I believe that one must first be able to exegete the passage first and show in the context the meaning that you put on the word or sentence or ve

#28 Mark, Sorry for the slowness. I am trying to slow down some as ministry work has taken up so much time and I am working on my first book. It isn’t easy to carve out a few hours at a time and whe

Mark, You said: > I never said i was a greek scholar…far from it. Look at your comment #354. You said: > As a greek scholar I am surprised at your comments. This is written as you claiming to be

Don, You said: > “We see examples of this truncation in Jonah, where he gives no escape clause in his warning, yet they escape;” While we do not have the words quoted from Jonah, we can know for su

Mark, you said: > Such far, you are failing heavily to read the context and have approached both [Eph 2:1](logos4:///Bible/Eph 2.1), and [Rom 6:11](logos4:///Bible/Ro 6.11) with a preconcieved ideas

Don #43, Sorry for taking so long in getting back to you.  I have had a full plate here for days 🙂 You said: > Jon 3:4  Jonah began to go into the city, going a day’s journey. And he called out, “Y

Michael, Martin, Paula – go ahead and continue to discuss the issues as I work on my responses. I may not be as fast as you folks are 🙂 Michael: Regarding your first post (#1).  You said:  “Cher

I received an email from a friend who was interested in dialogging on the issue of sin but didn’t want to post on the blog so I am going to address their concerns/questions to me here for everyone to

Okay, I’m back. There must be a limit to how long these posts and comments can be because my post kept disappearing. Oh well, to carry on… Michael you said “I am sleepless so I have been surfing the

#97 Mark, > By the way let me be clear that i do not think that non-calvinists are not Christians. I myself was not always convinced of reformed theology but i would never have said i wasn’t saved. N

bgk #54, > The carageenan in my ice cream comes from seaweed, but I don’t know if it has seeds.  Very cute!  And a mighty fine sense of h

Mark, > I appreciate your comments regarding [Gen 3:15](logos4:///Bible/Ge 3.15). Let me just say one final thing in case you missed it. I do agree with you that looking bcak at this verse in our pos

Mark, You said: > I don’t think you should doubt Jesus. But I don’t think taking universal language the way you do is correct. After all [Romans 5](logos4:///Bible/Ro 5) says that Jesus justified ‘

Mark, Thanks for taking the time to explain your limited experience with Arminianism. This helps a lot to understand why it is difficult for you to get the opposing viewpoint. It is now clear that y

Craig, You said: > Is it > “usurp the authority of an accepted/authorized teacher before you yourself have been authorized” > as Kristen has put forward or to “dominate” as I think you believe.

Good day Kerryn (that’s Canadian for gidday!) Great questions. You said: > The verses you use to make your point regarding Adam being a ‘man’ use the word anthropos, ([Romans 5:12,19](logos4:/

Cheryl, I understand your position on [1 Timothy 2:12-15](logos4:///Bible/1Ti 2.12-15) to be that Paul is telling one specific wife in the church to stop teaching her husband false doctrine, and that

Don, You said: > Everyone SHOULD have a current understanding and should be teachable, but if something does not convince them, then it would be bad faith to pretend it did. I agree completely.  We

Mark, You said: > So we both agree that God draws, calls, opens eyes, soften hearts all before people accept the message of Christ. But yet i guess we still disagree that faith is a gift. I’m quite

>”God has placed us all under sin so that we would all be in a position to have faith in Him instead of earning our way to God.””My friend, let me say it this way. If Jesus was born with the same natu

Lin, Thank you for expressing your thoughts so clearly and by doing so you have encouraged me too!  I too feel the same way as you do.  These are our brothers in Christ who deserve to be encouraged

Paula, I am going back to the comments from #10 as I took a break for a few days to deal with other matters. I am glad that you agree with me that the passage is literal. I asked you “what was Adam

On a previous thread, I referred to an audio download from Walter Martin that I had listened to that day: <http://www.spiritwatch.org/cultrise79.ram> I’m amazed at how much of what he said stuck wi

Charis, No you are not going to be disowned here. It is my desire that this blog will always be a loving community. One way to show love and community is to show acceptance. Another important way to

bgk, > Cheryl, you put up a straw man.  I did not say God gives permission and then withdraws it.  I said God can make exceptions and that not all exceptions are necessarily recorded in every place.

Hi Michael, You ask a great question about the creation of animals. First of all in answer to your question, the issue is not about animals ONLY being created after Adam. The Hebrew is specific in th

Mark you said: > [Mat 13:44](logos4:///Bible/Mt 13.44) “Again the kingdom of heaven is like treasure hidden in a field, which a man found and hid; and for joy over it he goes and sells all that he ha

Cheryl, I never said i was a greek scholar…far from it. I would have considered you one though (which is what i said), that is why it worried me that you ignored the many meanings the present indicat

“H”, Your point is well taken. If we continue to lift scriptures from their context, then we are left with following a new “law” to the letter – are men lifting their hands in prayer as Paul “require

Greg, Thanks for taking the time to flesh out your view. > 1) When I argued that humankind also has the ability to fulfill the law of Christ, I was thinking in terms of [Galatians 6:2](logos4:///Bi

My response to Matt’s post: > My pastor is very, very interested in finishing his communication with you in person. He is not back until August. Anytime after mid August is fine. There will be no nee

Mark #35, I am behind at least a day in my responses so I will be working backwards through the comments. You said: > My wife and i have no decided that i make the final call because i am a better

Hi Peter, You wrote: I am not sure if I hit a nerve with you, but the conversation is becoming slightly less than irenic, and I think it is best to leave it before it becomes personal. Thanks for the

#230 Craig, You said: > One of the staff at my church said egals use a “different hermeneutic”. I have often heard comps say it is a “liberal hermeneutic”. I don’t really understand what they mean,

Donna, You said: > “So, what I have suggested to myself and to others is to stay in your communities and discuss these things of common interest.” I don’t think that we need to necessarily stay in

Kay and Cheryl, I was never a hard core apologetic Armininan. I believed what i heard in churches, namely, that predestination is based on foreknowledge of our faith. I never had an issue with this,

#67 Kristen, You said: > Cheryl, I like your view; I really do. I just wish there were some way for me to get around what seems to me to be a real fact about this passage: that the context of this

Hi, new here. [though I have read off and on] I come from that Radical Feminist camp [years of study/and I still advocate on women’s rights issues] so I’d like to address some things here. Because th

Lin, You asked: > Really, we are seeing more of this from other Christians than we are from the secular world: Name calling, hate, sarcasm, lording it over, deception, lying, etc. All of this to adv

Don, You said: > I used to think there was ONE RIGHT WAY to interpret each verse in the Bible, but more and more I see there are “clouds” of various ways to understand various verses and a believer

Don, You said: > On 2, lots may be votes or they might be random, it is not clear. Even if random the lot is in the hands of the Lord as they were acting in faith. There is no other place in script

Don, I have heard the interpretation before about the Gnostic teaching that woman authored the man. Although I do believe that it is possible that Paul could have somehow been referring to this teac

Metacrock, No offense taken at all. I don’t mind people arguing with passion. I happen to love people who have lots of passion. By the way, you may be interested to know that “a woman” absolutely can

Wow, we are up to comment 55 and still haven’t begun looking at the text! You are correct in assuming that i haven’t read or know alot of what Wayne Grudem has written. In fact i have a book on the

Mark, You said: > Therefore to deny that saving faith is in itself not a gracious gift of God necessitates that it is something we do without the help of God. Who is claiming that our faith is “wi

Mark, You said: > Let me see if I understand your view. > 1. Jesus draws every single person in the world to himself > 2. But not everyone comes to the Father > 3. Those who come to the Fathe

Under question #10 I asked: > If Adam was a leader of his wife, then he would have to be called to account for his failed “role” as a leader. Eve also would have to be called to account for failing t

#36 Cindy K, > And I’m glad you’re catching up and specifically said so, as I had a tiny twinge of concern that I might have shut down the discussion, (even though I found that unlikely). If you wer

Paula, “I didn’t say they were equal in length, but that the days would be equal to ages, that is, they would stand for ages.†I went back and reread. You are correct, my error. I misread. “

Mark, You said: > The parellel is the same with Adam and the woman. Just because God uses a human agent does not detract from God’s foreknowledge. The text simply saids that it was the man who ‘nam

I have seen some blogs/web sites/discussion boards that claim to be Christian and they delight in abusing those who do not believe the same way as they do on secondary issues.  I am thoroughly amazed

@Mark #43 > I would have thought that an exegesis based on one’s own un supported grammtical interpretation would be a hole to begin with…a major hole. Unsupported? No true at all but seems to be yo

Here is my “iron sharpens iron” attempt. Jon 3:4  Jonah began to go into the city, going a day’s journey. And he called out, “Yet forty days, and Nineveh shall be overthrown!” is the verse I was ref

> I linked to that article onto Matt’s site and then figured out how to copy the article with the graphics so that those on Matt’s site can be blessed by it too without having to go off of his discuss

Tarun, Again, welcome and thanks for posting. > You said: I was not trying to imply that the Husband “is” the Saviour/Lord and God of his wife.That is a role that only Christ can fulfill. However ev

It has been a long day for me, but I am going to try to answer as much as I can before I head for bed. Mark, You said: > I have no problem saying that God was in control of what Adam said and knew

Hi Martin, Dave Hunt is a very good apologist in my opinion. We will attending his conference this summer and then I will get to meet him in person. As far as Sandy Simpson and his DVD – yes there w

#24 Mark, > Cheryl i cant help but feel that you base the comp position on yours and others experience, rather than the bible. That’s because I don’t see the position in the Bible. The only thing I

Hi Michael, I am not a young earth type per se, because I just want the truth of God’s word and whatever that is, is good with me. I have looked at Hugh Ross’ material and I have seen his debates

Pinklight and Don, I apologize for being so slow in answering.  Your thoughts and your questions are worthy of a new post of their own and I will be doing another post on Eve’s comments.  There is so

Cheryl, I appreciate where you are coming from. But first of all i have never deemed myself a ‘calvinist’ because simply it puts me into a theological bucket i don’t want to be in. Nor have i said th

Charis, I apologized because I got the date wrong. I also wanted to re-listen to the quote myself and couldn’t find it. I know that he said that I couldn’t come back on the program because I was “rad

NN (214): “If interested for gmail chat ingarandur[AT]gmail[DOT]com – it is so much quicker to figure out where the common ground is for a starting point in the discussion that way, and easier to st

Alex #56, I had to stay away from this topic for a bit as it took me back to a very painful time and I just needed space in order to breathe again. You said: > Cheryl, I understand what you’re say

Ah, I think I am finally coming to the end of Mark’s challenges. Mark, you wrote: > Cheryl has told me before that Eve was not “a threat”. What a wrong understanding of sin. I would challenge Cheryl

Mark, You said: > No issue with [John 6](logos4:///Bible/Jn 6) and surrounds, but please don’t compare me to a JW. I am not comparing you to a JW. You have to understand one thing – my ministry si

Hi Pan. The law allows for a certain level of “assault”, if you will, when it involves domestic parties. Parents can legally spank their children – to a degree – and a certain level of physical restr

Dear Cheryl, This blog has been so quiet…. I spent a very very long time last night reading through some of the stuff over there. I figured out I could turn OFF the posters which were triiggering m

I think we are really getting off topic here and I think it might be good to move this discussion somewhere else. I just don’t know where that somewhere else would be right now. I will have to think a

Hi Matt, Thank you for coming to this blog. You are most certainly welcome here and your opposing viewpoint is welcome to be expressed. Don’t be surprised, though, if you find some well thought out c

Thanks so much for your patience with me. I had some ideas swirling around but I have only a rudimentary greek training and rely on strong’s and the interlinear. I don’t know the conjugations of verbs

Paula: “As you surely know, ‘most commentators’ is an appeal to popularity. ” Not really. See <http://philosophy.lander.edu/logic/popular.html>: “If an elite group of people are in a position to kn

Don, 1. In [1 Cor. 15](logos4:///Bible/1Co 15) we see several very interesting observations that will help us to understand this passage. First of all we see that each “group” of listing of people do

Don, Your statement is beautiful.  I really don’t understand the “my way or the highway” approach to some of these matters that some camps hold, and it applies to a great many different doctrines, no

I just wanted to remind people that this blog is open for questions and for challenges from those who agree with me and those who disagree with me. I believe that as Christians we can dialog with grac

John, Welcome to my blog! I am delighted that you came to answer to our concerns. 1. Although it is already noted that a woman is not to follow her husband into “sin”, there is a whole lot of quest

NO you are not “the enemy”! Actually I only read a few chapters in the one book (and just this am I found a link to an online book- The Final Quest, which BTW has some of the quotes you referenced i

Hi folks, wow, what a lot of good comments! I will be popping in and out as I am able since this is a really busy time for me. NN, you said: > And if you read what I wrote above – the proper use of

Mark, You asked: > A note to everyone else- i am currently reading through ‘Discovering Biblical Authority’ and would be greatly interested in discussing issues in it with people- Cheryl should this

Jessica, You said: > I have not always been a complementarian and have been humbled in the past few years as I have discovered what I believe to be the gracious design that God has for men and wome

Th[is 1985](logos4:///Bible/Is 1985) paper by Harold Bussell (which I found through the link at Cindy’s post on [evangelical Christians’ vulnerability to cults](http://undermuchgrace.blogspot.com/2008

Cheryl, I’m glad I popped by too 🙂 and lets use your style of response to clarify my stance, (C)There are many things that Jesus is to the Church that the husband is not. (T) I agree. (C)Althou

Cheryl and et al., I pray that Jesus guides each word I am about to write, because it is important for me to miss anything. I do talk to Jesus all the time and today He and I have been going over a l

Gazza #169, As usual you have well-thought-out questions that shows you are thinking through the process. Bravo! > Firstly in [1 Timothy 1](logos4:///Bible/1Ti 1) v14-17 Paul goes on from saying he

For those who are interested in my answers. #50 “Patrick” writes: > I agree with most of this, the singular does not necessitate a specific singular woman. I agree the singular needs to be noted, y

Mark, Can you provide me with another email address so I can get the answers to your personal challenges sent to you. Or should I assume that you don’t care to hear answers on the other subject (out

Hey Mark, I am delighted that you are still reading here on my blog. And I am very glad that you found some time to try to point out any weaknesses that you think might be in my argument. It gives me

I would also like to comment on John’s quote: “A person who pushes for equality in the Church to their own benefit is doing it from their own flesh and not from a pure heart.” I agree with what Lin

Hi Cheryl, As I read your post, and the subsequent comments I was disappointed to find that no one mentioned the scripture in Genesis that speaks directly to Father God/Jehovah’s gender/lack there o

Mark, You said to Kay: > Let me encourage you to look at the passage exegetically. In my experience i rejected reformed theology, but after I studied this text my arminianism was shattered. My armi

#46 Charis, > I feel frustrated at having to keep repeating myself. I am truly sorry for your frustration. I personally do not mean to offend you in any way and I can also sense your frustration. I

Mark, I would be honored to be known as your friend! These kinds of dialogs, I believe, are very helpful for understanding. It is my personal opinion that when there is a disagreement we all need to

I believe that what John is writing about is the fruit of practiced sin. In other words this is the habit that one practices i.e. one practices hatred and therefore unforgiveness. A true Christian may

Hello Cheryl and all of you in this forum. I am a relatively new believer and for months now I have had the issue of women preachers on my heart and in my mind so much so that at times I’m awake in th

Though we attended an Assemblies of God Church, I was fed a fairly steady diet of Ken Copeland from the time I was a young teen. Later, my mother forced a great deal of Benny Hinn on me, and I’d been

Wow – am I late to the party. This discussion is great and I don’t want to get too far into gender wars. On the other hand, being the token male here (right now), I suspect and hope my perspective wil

“. . . because they did not have an answer to her explanation of the Greek from the original Greek manuscripts, but also because they told her as a woman that she was to be quiet.” Neither of these a